Points per hour and fairness

[Moru]

Ok, there has been a lot of spam in the chat about this so mabe we can move the discussion back to the forums instead. I realized the previous talk was in the swedish section in swedish so starting a new here.

Original thread from here: viewtopic.php?t=17070

Just to clarify what the discussion is about: The point system in Turf is self-balanced. This is believed to be as fair as we can get it with current game rules. Areas with few players get more points per take (PPT) and a lower point per hour (PPH) as long as you hold the zone. Areas with many players get lower PPT since they can take the zones more often. Instead they get more points per hour they keep the zone to balance the total score.

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So here is an updated detalied comparison on september round 2024 with two extreme cases.

The contestants:
#1 AJHB (mainly London, UK) (placed #2 in the world)
#2 Nihilisten (Umeå, Sweden) (placed #70 in the world)

#1 - Average speed 11 km/h
A lot of long travels all over UK. I cut at 50 km/h but you still get a higher average due to accelleration and slow streets getting counted in.
#2 - Average speed 9 km/h
Only bike and three towns, biking between them. Turfing similar to how everyone turfs around here.

How much less or more did player #2 do or get compared to player #1:

#2 took 519 zones more
#2 got 1082667 points less or about 32% of #1’s score
#2 traveled 180 km less than #1 or about 90% of #1’s distance

#1 had to revisit 231 zones more than #2

#1 spent 26.4 hours less than #2 actively turfing
#1 got 555 points more per kilometer traveled than #2

How important was the PPH for each user?
#1 got 64% of the points from PPH
#2 got 32% of the points from PPH

If you compare the column with PPH gained from every day, #1's numbers has one more zero than #2 almost every day.
Ex:

Code: Select all

		 #1      #2
Tuesday 1	60085	4951
Monday 2	68702	3393

PPH breakout:
#2 needs to turf 38 minutes extra per hour to keep up with #1’s PPH
#1 needs to turf 3 minutes extra per hour to keep up with #2’s PPH

This means that after sleeping 8 hours, #2 needs to turf for 307 minutes just to catch up with #1.
#1 needs to turf 26 minutes to catch up to #2. After that it's only adding to the distance.

Code: Select all

RAW DATA:

                                                                                                                                                                   Duration    Average  
              Sessions     Week        Day     Duration     Zones   Points tota Points tp Points pph  PPH importance   Takeovers   Assists   Revisits      Km          H        Km/h       P/km    
AJHB                  68        105          0          0       3286    1607630     579544    1028086             64 %       3020         12        254       1841      157,8       11,7      871,4 
Nihilisten           117        111          0          0       3805     524963     358436     166527             32 %       3627        155         23       1661      187,2        8,9        316 
Diff                  49          6          0          0        519   -1082667    -221108    -861559         -32,23 %        607        143       -231       -180       29,4       -2,8     -555,4 


                  Average PPH  Average PPT Hours    minutes    8 hours    
#1             10280861223,91    3672,65    0,05       3,24         26 
#2               166527198,25    1914,72    0,64      38,35        307 

 

This is the base of the discussion, you don't need to give advice of all the other benefits and ways of playing the game. For you that love to play it your way, it's fine. This conversation is not important to you. You do you, have fun!

But for those of you that love to compete, this point system isn't fair so be aware of that before you put any sort of effort into the game. Be aware that if you live in an area with a lot of people, you will have to travel extensively to be able to place high. You need to go to areas that has few players to collect a lot of zones. That will give you a groundplate of PPH income so you can put as much of your effort into actually get ahead of the competition as possible. You don't want to work eight hours per day just to keep even with the top 5 players.

For you that live in a sparsely populated area with only a few zones, yes you will have to travel even more to get points at all. This game is probably not for you.

If you live in an area with lots of people that do not play Turf, this game is definitely for you. Collect lots of yellow zones, you get 50 pts extra for them so 235 PPT. Try to take all zones in your area and fan out. Start the month with long trips to get the zones further away. The

[Mikey]

Turf killed the fun with UK and DE. I compete against people with 10000 less takes but with 10 000 000 points more...it is nothing but laughable. As long as they dont address this stupidity turf is a joke. And even though the game is so silly unfair they still bombard theese areas with even more zones...people having 400-1500 yellow zones alone and lots of nice streaks along the countries of UK and DE...the rest...dont get crap..in best case 1 zone each 2 months even though we have 200 turfers in a small town. They can take greed- and other medal we can only dream of. So unfair.

UK and DE must have bribed turf crew, otherwise I have no clue why they do this. And ofcourse they sit quiet and do not defend or change nothing.

[Maqqan]

UK and DE must have bribed turf crew, otherwise I have no clue why they do this. And of course they sit quiet and do not defend or change nothing.

Would be nice with a bribe! Haven't seen that yet.

Hard to make everyone happy.

I wrote a respons on Facebook, translated below.
In Norway we tried creating only a few zones in the major cities and ever fewer in the small ones. The idea was that when Turfer took them and telled there friends about it we would create more. Like the process has been in Sweden. But instead the Norwegian turfers got tired of never being able to compete with the Swedish turfers who had much more zones to take. And Norway is still a very inactive Turf country.

With that experience we tried a different tactic for Great Britain and Germany. Where the zones are created before the players come active.

[Mikey]

I wrote a respons on Facebook, translated below.
In Norway we tried creating only a few zones in the major cities and ever fewer in the small ones. The idea was that when Turfer took them and telled there friends about it we would create more. Like the process has been in Sweden. But instead the Norwegian turfers got tired of never being able to compete with the Swedish turfers who had much more zones to take. And Norway is still a very inactive Turf country.

With that experience we tried a different tactic for Great Britain and Germany. Where the zones are created before the players come active.

Fair enough, but now that they have alot of turfers, why not give the other active countries more zones....we have alot of space and alot of turfers but we get no zones. Now it is the opposite, we cant compete with them (UK and DE) and they can get medals that we never can. So time to give Sweden the same if you want to keep turfers.